Talk:Dark Wings, Dark Words
Catelyn and Jon Brace yourselves, guys. Word out on the street (from Westeros.org and other sources) is that the second episode of Season 3 contains an "invented" scene for Catelyn Stark, which some are calling tantamount to character assassination. Of course, TV-Catelyn has so drastically diverged from book-Catelyn in the first two seasons that this is just yet another trip down that path, apparently. The vague pattern we've noticed is that they deny Catelyn "political agency", give decisions she makes in the books to Robb in the TV show, and increasingly make her whine about "I just want to see my children!" as if the only way to make a female leader sympathetic is to lock her into being a stereotypical mother-role. I think they're trying to make her mother sympathetic and soft, but it comes off as whiny and weak. My guess is that they felt they need to go above and beyond with Catelyn because they thought the viewers would not understand her hatred of Jon Snow, and see her as a "wicked stepmother", unless they hit us over the head (almost literally) with "she's a loving mother!". Anyway, the actual scene itself doesn't sound too out of keeping from the books. All I've heard is that it's Catelyn giving a long monologue on her feelings about Jon Snow (I don't think that's too spoilery to mention here on the Talk page). My running guess is that this actually does correspond to the book scene in which Robb decides he needs to name a legal heir (given that they think Bran and Rickon are dead, and Sansa and Arya to be in Lannister captivity); Robb wants to name Jon Snow but Catelyn insists on naming an incredibly distant relative from House Royce. So if it's "a monologue by Catelyn on her feelings about Jon Snow" that does correspond to something from the books, or seems brought up by something from the books. But multiple reviewers - Westeros.org being only the most prominent - who have seen advanced screener copies said it felt like a "character assassination" moment. I have no idea what that means: book fans would be outraged that she once again diverges even further away from book-Catelyn in her feelings about Jon Snow? Or would even TV fans feel it just seems out of character? Either way, all of the advanced reviews say that for folks worried about "adaptation from book to screen", the shit hits the fan in this episode.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 01:40, March 30, 2013 (UTC) :Well, she does have some inner monologues about how she distrusts Jon Snow.--Gonzalo84 (talk) 02:21, March 30, 2013 (UTC) :TDD: basically, in the scene, a jailed depressed Catelyn regrets not having loved Jon Snow as a son and says that all her family's missfortunes are her fault for having angered the gods. RR April 5, 2013 ::....this....this is madness. Absolute madness.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 15:05, April 5, 2013 (UTC) To do We have lots to do as a new episode airs. Below is a list of aims to get us up to date with this episode. Please strike through any completed tasks. The aims for the moment are: #Update the lead to change the tense of the premiere date--Opark 77 (talk) 19:01, April 14, 2013 (UTC) #Ensure the writer and director are listed--Opark 77 (talk) 19:01, April 14, 2013 (UTC) #Ensure that the relevant writer and director articles have been updated--Opark 77 (talk) 19:21, April 14, 2013 (UTC) #Check that the synopsis is correct.--Opark 77 (talk) 19:33, April 14, 2013 (UTC) #Update Template:Episodes to reflect the correct episodes.--Opark 77 (talk) 21:21, April 14, 2013 (UTC) #Copy edit the summary.--Opark 77 (talk) 20:45, April 14, 2013 (UTC) #Write a recap #Check that the notes section is in place and includes an explanation of the title reference where possible #Compare the episode to the source material and note the relevant chapters in the notes section #Ensure the characters section is in place and note first appearances and deaths #Ensure all new characters have an article #Consider adding new characters to relevant family tree and navbox templates #Ensure all deceased characters articles are updated to reflect this #Ensure the cast section is in place and matches the credits of the episode #Ensure all new cast members have an article. #Ensure all relevant cast articles are updated to reflect the cast members work in the current season and credit in this episode #Update Season 3 Cast with information from the episode. #Complete the cast notes section noting changes to the starring cast, credits order and significant uncredited appearances #Consider updating Season 3 or Starring cast where cast notes reflect major changes. #Ensure all relevant character articles are update to reflect the character's appearance in this episode #Ensure all relevant character articles are updated with a summary of their role in this episode and a reference citing this episode as the source of the information #Work through the recap creating articles for Red Links #Ensure the appearances section is in place and notes the houses, creatures, items and locations that appear in the episode #Ensure the relevant house articles are update with a summary of their role in this episode and a reference citing this episode as the source of the information #Ensure all relevant location articles are updated with a summary of their appearance in the episode and a reference citing this episode as the source of the information #Add Memorable Quotes from the episode #Add screenshots of new characters to the image gallery #Add screenshots to illustrate the summary and recap #Consider whether plot developments warrant changing any of our navboxes (see Category:Template (Navigation)) #Add screenshots of key moments to illustrate the recap and ensure they are also present on the relevant related articles--Opark 77 (talk) 18:58, April 14, 2013 (UTC)